Burns Chronicles No 7 – What is Brandon Curtiss?

http://outpost-of-freedom.com/blog/?p=1349

Burns Chronicles No 7
What is Brandon Curtiss?

Brandon

Gary Hunt
Outpost of Freedom
February 15, 2016

I received a phone call from Ryan Payne, shortly after the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge was entered by nine people, and restored to ‘open to the public’. Ryan indicated that there was a need for others to come join them, as they were concerned for the safety of such a small crew.

Now, many will question why they might be concerned for their safety, however, we need only consider the last few weeks to understand, as many patriots do, that the federal government tends to solve problems with bloodshed, unless all parties come out with their hands up, and submit to arrest whether there is a real crime, or not.

With the understanding that those who might enter the Refuge, since renamed Harney County Resource Center (HCRC), might find that the government would want to arrest them, it was felt by the Operation Mutual Defense Advisory Board (OMD-AB) that a caveat regarding that possibility be included in a call out.

Upon being advised, through other sources, that Brandon Curtiss, Idaho III%, had secured a 40-acre parcel for visitors to camp on, this seemed to be the solution to an alternate location for those who might otherwise not show up because of the caveat.

However, one of those inside of the HCRC expressed his concern that Brandon (“Brandon” will be used as a collective name for Idaho III% and Pacific Patriot Network (PPN), and the individual, as appropriate to the context), had stated that he was there, along with his following, to assure that there would not be another Waco, and suggested that “he would probably drop his gun and run, should things change for the worse”. It was with this in mind that I sought to contact Brandon, on behalf of OMD, and managed to do so through Pete Santilli, on January 10.

When I told Pete that I was trying to reach Brandon, he said, “just a minute”, and he handed his phone to Brandon. Brandon was cordial in the first part of the discussion, though he was rather assertive. “Any militia that come to Burns are under my command”, he said. That sounded like a sort of militia martial law, and Brandon, with 8 or 9 years of law enforcement experience, but no military experience, has taken command. But, then, I knew this was the “prime directive” when I called for Brandon. He also claimed to have secured forty acres for camping purpose, directly across from the Refuge, though I found out later that it was directly across from the Narrows, about six miles from the Refuge. Perhaps he “secured” it, or perhaps it was a fantasy, as he did not even know where it was.

I had been directed by the OMD-AB to ascertain whether, if Brandon decided to order everyone to go home, would he release those who came under the OMD banner? For him to understand what this question was being posed, seeking a solution, I prefaced it with the “drop guns” concern.

Can I say that I was surprised when he “dropped the phone and ran”? Well, I wasn’t as surprised as I might have been, since the first few minutes on the phone, I was mostly listening, while Brandon appeared to want to both ask and answer his question as well as the reason for my call.

Pete, endeavoring to get patriots to work together, reestablished communications by having Brandon call me. This time, however, it sounded as if we were on speakerphone, and additional parties were present, including Eric Parker and Brooke Agresta.

I tried to explain that I am old school, and when you seek a solution, you must understand the problem. I don’t believe that they ever fully digested that thought, as they spent quite a few minutes berating me, telling me what I said, which is not what I said, since I didn’t have the opportunity, and finally concluded with Brooke telling me that she would destroy me in the patriot community if I didn’t do something (I don’t recall what) in the next three minutes, as she spoke for the next two minutes and then hung the phone up.

Well, that discussion didn’t go to well, so I had to find an alternative for those who didn’t want to risk the possible consequences of staying inside of the HCRC. That, however, would have to be put off to another day.

That was my first ‘introduction’ to Brandon Curtiss, though his name had come up earlier. In a report given by Ryan Payne to an OMD-AB special meeting, November 19, nearly two months before the above incident, Ryan Payne explained some circumstances surrounding the meetings held with both the Hammonds and Sheriff Ward. The report, though second hand, bears out what subsequent events tend to substantiate. The pertinent part of the report can be heard in this 12: 30 – clip, Ryan Payne speaking.

The foundation for subsequent activities by PPN, Idaho III%, and to some degree, OathKeepers, is clearly established.

My next dealing with Brandon Curtiss occurred on January 28, two days after the murder of LaVoy Finicum. Due to the arrests made during theAmbush, I no longer had access to people and information that were necessary to what I intended to write. Though my room was booked for another night, I had decided to return home where I am accustomed to writing. So, I began loading my truck for the return journey.

The evening before, I had written a call out (explained in Stand Up; Stand Down). In that call out, I had recognized the necessity of an immediate response, and that response would have to come from the Harney County area, to be effective. What it said in part, was:

“Attention all Oathkeepers, Idaho Three Percenters, Pacific Patriots Network, especially Brandon Curtiss, Joe Rice, Eric Parker, and Stewart Rhodes.

. . .

You have an obligation to proceed to the Harney County Resource Center (the wildlife refuge), immediately, in order to protect the patriots still there. If you fail to arrive, you will demonstrate by your own actions that your previous statements to defend life, liberty, and property were false.

As I was carrying some things to the truck, a man walked up to me. I recognized him as Curtiss, and I noticed that there were 4 other men with him, all in their twenties or thirties, and 3 of them quite husky. Brandon introduced himself, and as is my habit, I extended my hand. He replied that he would not shake my hand and then accused me of calling him a coward. Now, the circumstances didn’t warrant, in most cases, my attention to exact words, however, my reply was something along the lines that I did not call him a coward, only his action, or lack thereof, would make that determination.

One of the, let me call them, “goons”, was taking video with his phone, so there exists a record of these dealings. So, if I am in error, let them come forward with the entire video.

As I continued to go to the room and return to the truck to load it, Eric Parker challenged me, as well. They tried to block my passage, and I had to walk around them. At one point, I was putting things in the back seat (4-door) and when I turned around, Curtiss had blocked as much of the area between the door and bed of the truck as he could block. There is no doubt that he wanted me to “push” my way through, and then claim that I had assaulted him. However, I turned sideways and managed to slide out and go about my business.

During the course of my coming and going from the room, I called the manager and asked him to call the cops; that I was being threatened and harassed. It might seem ironic to some that I ended up calling the cops on someone who spent 8 or 9 years as a cop, but why not give him a taste of his own medicine?

While the harassment continued, and threats were being made, I heard a voice from behind me saying, “Leave him alone!” One of the beefier goons went up and faced this rather short, wiry guy. When I glanced back over that way, a few seconds later, the goon had decided not to take on the little guy.

The manager walked by and told me that he had finally gotten through to the police. Just a minute or so later, Brandon offered me his hand. I told him that he had his chance, and chose not to take it. At about the same time, the little guy said, quite loudly, “Don’t do it”, meaning don’t shake his hand. I was really beginning to like this guy.

When I had the truck nearly loaded, I went over to see who this supporter was. I asked him if I knew him. He simply replied, “Wolf”. He explained that he was a friend of KC Massey, and it struck me that I had interviewed him when I did the story of the shooting by the BPS agent. I couldn’t recall, at that time what his real name was, and now that I do, I think I’ll just leave it at “Wolf”.

He told me that he had been asked to go to Burns to protect me, though he refused to say who gave him those instructions. So, that will remain a mystery to both the reader, and me but it was nice to know that someone, besides my family, was concerned for my safety.

While still talking with Wolf, the police finally arrived. I explained what had occurred to the officer. In the meantime, another patriot that I had met the night before had been watching from the second floor balcony, and he came down and joined us. Both he and Wolf confirmed what I told the cop.

Meanwhile, other cops were interrogating Brandon and the goons, so that head cop, the one that I had spoken to, went over to put the pieces together. Soon, he returned and said, “Everything has been taken care of. You have nothing to worry about. If there is a problem, call us and we well be here, right away.” I thanked him and wished him a good day.

Meanwhile, the second floor patriot was joined by his girlfriend. I offered to take all to breakfast, but Wolf decided it would be his treat. We went to a local truck stop and had a great breakfast, and a wonderful conversation between real patriots.

Interestingly, my dealings with Brandon Curtiss were not over. On February 4, just after 11:00 AM, I received a Facebook PM from him. It started out, “All bullshit aside with our differences, I am not planning on storming any barricades. That would be insane. This is getting spun up and out of control.”

This led to a rather extended PM exchange, and a phone call (identified in the PM), that led to what I thought would be a resolution of our differences and beginning to work together. It had to do with a conversation that I had earlier with someone who contacted me as he was traveling to Oregon.

The post in question, which will also appear in the PMs, states that PPN “will march through the barricades and through the FBI.” This information was passed on as unconfirmed, but would be necessary for the person to get to the Narrows and be prepared to bring those who were not affiliated with PPN to join them, if it were true.

My team continued to track the source of that information in an effort to confirm, or deny, the “information”. It had become quite apparent that many absurd stories had been circulating, by that time.

At 11:03 AM, February 4, I get a Facebook PM from Brandon Curtiss.

Curtiss 02

At 11:27 AM, begins the explanation as to what had occurred, and what the OMD position was in the matter. To aid the four inside (Fry, 2 Andersons & Banta), we wanted to see if we could get them some relief so that we could be sure of “holding the fort” long enough to put out a general call, hoping for many more to come to Burns to assist in keeping the public lands open to the public.

At 11:32, I suggest that we begin working together. Brandon agreed. Then, I indicate what the OMD position is, that we need the relief to get in to the Refuge.

Curtiss 01

At about 12:30 Brandon wanted to go telephonic. Not yet being sure that I could rely on what he said, based upon the previous experience, Irecorded the call. A timeline to key parts of the conversation follows:

0:24 – 4:00: Explanation of how we can hold the ground. Brandon builds obstacle to discourage any real action. Then, he explains that he got a call from Oregon State Police (OSP) — based upon what he had sent me (in PM at 11:18 AM). So, I have to wonder why they called him. They didn’t call me, though I appear to be an instigator. Does Brandon have some special relationship with the OSP? Did they call him to get him to thwart any action that might provide relief to those inside?

5:06 – 7:50: He suggests that this would be a “point of no return”. Darn, someday, if we want constitutional government restored, there will be a “point of no return”. He thinks that we would need a thousand “well trained patriots”. To form the battle line that has been suggested would only require discipline. If we cannot get our country back without “well trained patriots”, then we just might as well put our hands behind our backs and back up to the nearest FBI agent. That is nothing more than an obstacle, really, an obstruction — which has little merit. When you have to fight, you fight with what you have. Patriots have been training for many years. Do we train into oblivion? However, I continued to discuss a tactic that has been presented, as that tactic would be both unanticipated and difficult to defend against.

8:29 – 9:00: Brandon talks about the call outs that they have done. Those call outs will be discussed, elsewhere, but they have been absent any show of force, rather, they are intended to just get people to Burns and let them be a burden on the town (See The Burns Community). Quite frankly, what he had, and continues to call for, has hurt far more than it helped those in the Refuge. He then states that those who had come to Burns, and the Refuge, scattered after LaVoy was shot. The cause and effect of that reaction is discussed in “Stand Up; Stand Down“, and there were persistent phone calls and text messages, from PPN, to those inside, to abandon their positions. This resulted in only 8 or 9 defenders by the next morning.

9:01 – 10:29: Discussion of passive and active support. Brandon seems to prefer passive (demonstrations), though he is Idaho III% (III% is the John Adams estimate of how many colonists FOUGHT, like with muskets, against the British). This is also the difference between Civil Disobedience, which might get you arrested, and Civil Defiance, which is defying the presumed authority with arms, as at the Bundy Ranch in April 2014. Then, he mentions LaVoy, and says that he doesn’t “want anyone else losing their life.” So, now we step into the world of “peaceful resolution”. That was the mantra of the FBI, Sheriff Ward, Judge Grasty, and, apparently, PPN, Idaho III%, and the OathKeepers.

13:40 – 16:40: Brandon explains that he spoke with Ammon and Ryan about letting them (Brandon) know when they were going to be “out and about” so they could be “over watch and scouting around”. So, they (Brandon) took a lot of hits since they weren’t there (at the shooting). However, the run into town has no good place for an ambush. It is wide open. Now, if someone wanted to provide “over watch and scouting around”, there was no reason for Brandon to drop that mission, since he should have known that the road to Grant County went through the Malheur National Forest, with plenty of trees, rolling country, and many curves — ideal for an ambush. As far as not being notified, the meeting in John Day was well advertised as much as a week, or more, before that fateful day. However, it is probably much easier to be sitting in a restaurant, enjoying a meal paid for by contributions made to support the operation, than to take the initiative and scout the route. If they had done so, it is quite apparent that the ambush location was established at least a day before, when branches were cut from trees to facilitate firing positions, snowmobile tracks, and the entire ambush area prepared, and probably quite obvious, at least to someone who could “scout” an area — before, not after, the fact.

18:25 – 19:10: Brandon has both numbers and was going to give them to B. J. Soper, presumably to let him know that we are “working together”.

21:44 – 22:04: Here, Brandon includes the FBI, along with OSP, as having contacted him. Why they have so much faith in getting answers from Brandon is a matter for speculation, at this point.

22:32 – 23:22: Brandon says, “Well, we will work through it. It’s okay. And the, by all of us coming to gather, and then working together, it just makes us stronger”…. We then, finally, “shook hands”, over the phone — that is the honorable thing that real men do. Then, he says, “This is what we all need to be doing, working together and building our network, you know, larger.”

So, we end the conversation with what should be a good and honorable working relationship.

On the morning of February 5, I discovered that, without notifying me, nor having received that call that Soper was supposed to have made to me, the “Call to Action” at the blockade had been changed to a demonstration at the site of LaVoy’s murder. Though I don’t have the original message that I received that morning, the following is the wording from pacificpatriotsnetwork.com:

Stand down for the Feb 6

So, what had been discussed (above) was simply tossed out the window, the location changed, and raises the question as to the sincerity of Brandon Curtiss, as we have learned to expect from government officials.

My comment, with regard to this “working together”, then continues the PM conversation. Needless to say, Brandon Curtiss’ true colors were amply demonstrated, not only by this most recent episode, but not in the least, inconsistent with what was reported by Ryan Payne, Brandon’s asserting authority over any militia that came to Burns, his abrupt rudeness and unwillingness to talk in the early conversations, and finally, this attempt to obtain information, suggest that he was honorable, and then assigning the responsibility, not on himself, as leader of Idaho III% and PPN, but on Soper, who was probably never informed of the telephone conversation and the agreement to work together.

6 Comments

  1. 15Fixer says:

    Thanks Gary, I like reading your input, please keep up the good work.

  2. After reading this post, I’m quite frankly confused by what I read.

    It appears that the proposed support of the Hammond family, and/or this seizure and occupation of the Malheur Wildlife Refuge (or whatever it is), was doomed before it even began, due to the seeming lack of organization and planning, further complicated by members openly disagreeing with each other.

    From what I see, once the Hammond family, and/or the local residents of Harney County, Oregon and Burns, Oregon had publicized their rejection and objection to offers of assistance, the proposed mission should have been cancelled.

    Mission success depended on favorable perception by the news media and the general public, and that wasn’t happening.

    The situation was made worse when the original purpose of the mission (i.e., the unlawful prosecution and incarceration of the Hammonds) was apparently forgotten and even further ignored during the confusion accompanying the seizure and occupation of a deserted and rather desolate federal facility.

    (Oh, by the way, how were the occupiers “impeding federal employees” if the federal facility was closed for the Winter, and there were no federal employees working there?)

    Additionally, such a mission would have a much better chance of eliciting general support and sympathetic response if it were initially done during warm weather, and not during the harsh conditions of Winter.

    Originally, the idea behind all this may have been a good one, but it obviously devolved into the wrong fight in the wrong place at the wrong time, with participants looking like panicky buffoons.

    At least, that’s how I currently see it, based on what I’ve seen on the Internet.

    Then again, maybe similar complications arose among members and supporters of the Sons of Liberty prior to 19 April 1775, with all their petty differences cast aside, once those first shots were fired at Lexington and Concord.

    • rick says:

      Dear John,

      I am confused too. But from what I have gathered the Hammonds were threatened to curtail all communication with the Bundys et al or else. The threats were from the feds. Previous to those threats of lengthened incarceration and confiscation of assets, the Hammonds enjoyed conversations with the Bundys.

      The occupation, in my estimation, failed to procure a clear message. At first it was about releasing the Hammonds. Then it became about govt over reach. There were many conflicting reports along the way. Often, those reports were interceded with what I call amateur attempts. You have the Oathkeepers, the III, and others saying they will then they won’t. There was Pete Santilli basically screwing up by misreporting or highlighting a ‘fact’ when yet unverified. Of course he never missed an opportunity to talk of his new black hat or that he was cutting edge journalist (Ladies and gentlemen, this just in) Effing self promotion. The Bundy message was unclear and the reports were confusing. Too many amateurs involved, not enough substantive reporting. The people were unconvinced. It was an atmosphere ripe for exploitation. The only story that was gotten out with any consistency was that the residents of Burns were against the ‘occupiers’. Even that was a lie. Perhaps the biggest lie.

      In the aftermath, after the MSM went home, after the self-promoters had departed, we see that the people of Burns were decidedly supportive of the ‘occupiers’.

      In my estimation, the charge of ‘impeding federal officers’ is contrived, fabricated, made up. Just prior to making these charges it was reported that refuge rangers wanted to go back to work but they couldn’t because…because their HQ was occupied. If that isn’t BS I don’t know what is. So of all that came out of this, that is the one charge??? What about trespass or tampering with fed govt equipment or a whole host of things? Utter BS. And to tell you the truth, most people across the USA would buy it. Most of this country have little idea what has been and is happening in the 11 western states. Nor would they care. O, some banditos out west got what’s coming. Why would the rest of the country eve connect this to the restrictions of the general govt as contained in the US Constitution? Wait…what?

      As far as picking the season, you have a very valid point. But remember this was in immediate response to the Hammonds being recalled to serve their term. Thereby, do you wonder if the govt had something to do with selecting the season? Should Bundy, et al waited until the snow melt? Would it matter anyway since Burns is in the middle of the middle of no where? I’ve been in isolation and I like it. But it isn’t the place if I were to wont to call people to my aid. No matter what the season but yes the winter would make it more difficult. In fact, one could say that that the selection of winter was to cull the tough and ready from the herd. What herd? Well, the herd of a flaccid population of course. As in any society, no matter how grave the threat, but a few would answer the call to arms. Does 3% ring a bell? Hells bells, even Plato warned of this.

      As much as it pains me to say, I completely agree with you that this was the wrong time. Except that if we were to look upon this not with jaundice but to see it as akin to the 2nd strike (See, American Revolution) we may develop the perception that yet another intolerable act has bee perpetuated upon the people. This especially since what is by all accounts a kindly, genteel man was gunned down-murdered-in an ambush perpetuated under a conspiracy to deprive one of life. Oh yes was this an ambush. Absolutely yes. What must possess the thinking man is if him why not me? The cold blooded murder of Robert Lavoy Finicum was intended as a clear message to any one of us that dare stand for liberty. ‘We will gun you down and sleep soundly in our beds.’ Is this your land, is this my land?

      In any case, these folks who took a stand failed to get the message out. They failed to present a clear message and they failed to be consistent when the message ‘evolved’ from one issue to the next. God forgive me for what I am about to write, I can hardly believe I am to say this: this was amateur hour at the Malheur. They failed to get the message out, then they failed to be consistent. For shame anyone who promised backup. But they poibly are forgiven because the message was never clear even from the beginning.

  3. rick says:

    Jeez Louise, this all reads like a soap opera. It’s like the Keystone Kops for crying out loud except its real and about standing up in defiance against an over reaching govt. I understand there may be petty bickering but what you have presented rises to such a scale as to jeopardize the entire operation. That is unacceptable. You best get squared away. Look in the mirror to see who I’m talking to. I’m no fan of Brandon but by God I’ll lone wolf it to defend my liberty if the likes of all y’all is the alternative. BTW: all I have to establish my cred is that while flat broke I had my truck loaded and headed for Burns until Lavoy was murdered in an ambush. Effing A I’m serious. But you guys appear to be as comical as girls. As for me, I refuse to be co-opted by misfits. Show me where I’m wrong. I gladly welcome constructive criticism. But eff y’all if you think what you and Brandon have presented o various blogs constitutes the fight for freedom. God bless you.

  4. Matt Grove says:

    This is a completly different guy, and was a year and a half ago. Same MO, I didn’t see you mention it, but Brandon Curtiss even has corporation funny business going on like this guy.
    https://operationamericanspring.wordpress.com/2014/05/16/anatomy-of-a-mole-2/
    OAS had the same stand up/stand down going on. There were multiple times this Roberto guy tried in late night campfires, or overly long rides he would take people on he would start talking about trying to setup a false flag and things like that.

    http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/Brandon-Curtiss/Meridian-Oregon-83642/Brandon-Curtiss-Curtiss-Property-Management-Liberty-Property-Management-Kept-rents-secur-1266116

    Blaine Cooper, his real name is Stanley Hicks. He along with Santilli(brandon’s claimed inspiration) and some others pulled similar things to this with the militias going to the border.

    The level of skuldugery going on with these things is insane. I have really come to the conclusion that people are going to have to really put anyone who says they want to lead’s feet to the fire.

    Oh, that phone call thing to get it off of chat where it is easier to show what had happened than having to listen to an audio recording, it’s SOP.

  5. Sk says:

    In addition to my past dealings with Brandon, these are the reasons I never will be part of anything he is involved in. At minimum he is a bumbling fool… All the way up to an informant who is leading Patriots to slaughter.

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Anti-Ambush Weapons

I knew I wasn’t imagining things

for many years, I distinctly remember reading about an “Anti-Ambush” weapon used in Rhodesia and South Africa back in the 70’s.  I remember reading about it in SOF Magazine, but going through what back issues of their magazine I have available to me I couldn’t FIND the article.

Well, I’ve been searching and looking and bothering people about if they have any information about it, (Ian at Forgotten Weapons, Rock Island Arsenal Museum, and quite a few others) I probably made a pest of myself over this particular weapon.

Finally I was doing some reading about Rhodesian Anti-Mining vehicles and there in one of the articles was a picture of the Pookie, with weapon on the front bonnet.

The weapon in question was called “The Spider” and it’s various incarnations would have anywhere from 8 to 36, 12 gauge barrels which could be fired either remotely or from inside a vehicle with a handcrank.

http://www.jmu.edu/cisr/journal/6.2/features/andysmith/andysmith.htm

Do you see that thing under the windscreen?  That looks like a bunch of pipes pointing out, THAT is “The Spider”.  that particular version had 8-16 barrels, that covered a 270 degree arc in front of the vehicle and was remotely fired from the cab of the Pookie.  Imagine facing THAT.  And having 16 barrels loaded with #4 buck suddenly firing at you.

Now in the original article I read many, many, MANY years ago, it was mentioned that the Terrs as they were called, put out a contract on the head of the person who designed “The Spider”, because it WAS so effective in breaking up an ambush.

Now there was also a version of the spider that had 3 rings of barrels, one stacked on top of the other, with the top most stack horizontal, the ones below it aim about 5 degrees down to give proper coverage.  Hit ’em high and hit ’em low and hit ’em in between.

For a vehicles in convoy, the lead vehicle would only have the the front and side barrels loaded, the vehicles behind would only have the side barrel loaded and the tail vehicle would have the rear and side barrels loaded.  That way they wouldn’t have any “Friendly Fire” incidents.

Imagine, having 36 barrels, 360 degrees of arc covered, and you could fill all 360 degrees with lead just by turning a crank inside your vehicle.  Using #4 shot that’s 972 .24 or 6.1 mm diameter pieces of lead traveling at over 800 FPS weighing almost 21 grains each.  And you could do that in less than 3 seconds.

Back to my story.

I went from tha article linked under the picture of Pookie, to some judicious use of Google Search terms and I found out there was an article written about Anti Ambush Weapons, used in Rhodesia, and “The Spider” had a decent write up in it with a few good pictures of the device.

That is where I ran into a brick wall.

There are NO, ZERO, NONE, NADA, copies of that article currently available on-line.  I wanted to bang my head on my keyboard.  I was SOOOOooooooooo Close, but I couldn’t find an on-line source for the article.

However, I did find, that hard copy of the article exists, after looking it up in the World Catalog, which lead me to a library in Europe.  And They HAD the periodical in question.  Hmmm however, they are in “Europe”, I’m in Texas.  How could I get a copy of the article, without it costing me an arm and a leg?

Well, I just asked.  I sent them an e-mail explaining that I’m trying to locate information about this particular system and inquiring how I could get either photocopies or a scanned PDF of it.

Three days later, I got a response, with a PDF copy of the article in question attached.

And they didn’t even charge me for it.  For which I am truly grateful.  The young lady who responded and sent the PDF told me that it was a one time thing and if I needed help in the future I would have to pay for the time of the Librarian and any copies or computer time.  And I agree with that, it takes TIME to scan in something and to ensure it scans in legibly and at a good resolution.  I know, I’ve done it in the past when I scanned in a bunch of stuff for Gutenberg.org, (When you have a bunch of 100+ year old books that have been in your family’s personal library and are somewhat rare you kinda want to get them out there for others to read)  So for scanning in the 27 pages and ensuring they are readable and the photo’s are properly discernible, I am eternally grateful to the lady who I shall NOT name.  (She’s MY contact pbbbttttt)

Anyway without further ado, here is the article after I extracted the pages and did just a few small touchups.

Below the fold to save on bandwidth.

I actually think this AK Gunship design is rather stupid myself.  The weapons are mounted outside of the vehicle and it only gives you the ability to fire in two or three directions if you hide one under the hood.  You have no way of changing the windage or the elevation without getting out of the vehicle.  Same for reloading.  I can possibly see a mini turret with one of the belt fed AR’s or even a belt fed .22 or AR in the pistol configuration.  If you set your elevation so it’s waist high at 30 meters, you should be good for any ambush situation.  And if you have a mini turret you an use the system below for your windage corrections.  Heck you can use a motor out of one of those power wheel Barbie Cars with a fwd/rev switch and a power switch to rotate your mini turret and a power door lock solenoid to actuate the trigger.  Set it with a ratchet mount inside the mini turret to be able to pull the weapon down to clear it and reload it you haven’t already linked all your ammo together.  Also you can put a cheap web cam or reverse/backup camera above the bore line and have that piped to you in the vehicle either on a dedicated screen/mini lcd TV or a lap top.

Hey the drop down barrel thing is sweet.  However there aren’t any good pictures of the “Release” mechanism.  It wouldn’t be too hard to make though.  It’s basically just a slam fire shotgun on a hinge with an end cap that has a small firing pin in it.  I wonder how much weight is necessary to hit the firing pin to set off a primer though.  I’m think they might have had quite a few misfire until they got the barrel length/weight just right to ensure it would fire EVERY TIME.

That IS just like a duckfoot pistol.  I know, I had two of the BP version of a duckfoot I got as kits.  That looks like it has a 90 degree arc of coverage.   If it’s set so pull one pin and they all fire in a chain fashion, it might not be as effective, because ambushers would realize that themselves and would know to approach from the side that would fire last.  that would give them enough time to get close enough to throw a grenade or take a shot at you.

Oh WOW!!  So there is probably one of the duckfoot type on the front and another on the very back.  and all operated by pulling a cable.  By my numbers that would be 6 cables to pull, unless you had it set up so you pull one and they ALL go.  But that might not be the most effective.  What if you only needed to to cover just one area, and you wanted to save your other barrels for any further ambushes down the road?  Especially since it would take 3-5minutes to reload and reset just ONE barrel, and you’ve got to reload 5-6 barrel on 6 different devices.  You don’t want to try to do that why you are being shot at.  Somebody could probably rig up an electrical solenoid to fire as few as 1 barrel or as many as 6 per device, but the control panel for that would be rather hard to operate in an ambush situation.

Here at the bottom of this page is where the entry on “The Spider” starts.

An original advertisement for “The Spider”

How many barrels on this version?  And I wanna see the inside of the breech block and the firing mechanism!!!!!

I think the one MAIN Disadvantage of this system is you can only reload it from OUTSIDE of the vehicle.  In the top photo above you can see the roof rack “The Spider” is mounted to.  In the second you can see that the breechblock is installed from the top and you can see the slotted cam for the handcrank which the breech mechanism sits on.  You can also see the beech mounting holes on the flange of the breechblock.

Well lookie there, right on the front of another “Pookie”

Here is the last part about “The Spider”, but the other stuff looks really interesting as well.

And the “Remote” gun below looks nice, but not a good as what we have today, however the tech is a LOT easier if you remove elevation controls.

Looks like an old fashioned black powder cannon to me.  Just electrically fired, which if you know what you are doing isn’t that hard.  And look at the blown out barrel at the top.  Somebody overloaded it for sure.

The Israeli’s have a large problem with rocket launcher made like this.  HAMAS will weld the barrel in under false bottoms of dump trucks and load the tubes with rockets to try to smuggle them into areas they can be launched against Israel.

The Holland-Hale and the Wattle Co cannons, I’d actually be scared of, unless “I” was the person in charge of them.  I’ve seen too many old BP muzzleloaders go KABOOM! because people either overloaded them or used the wrong powder.  And if you EVER use smokeless powder in a BP Muzzleloader, you deserve your Darwin Award.

They needed to add a “Deflector” to this in order to make sure it’s safe for going through occupied areas.  If you ask me, they didn’t design it right if they needed to add that.

HEY!!!  I built stuff like that when I was in the Army.  And we were SPECIFICALLY TOLD NOT to do it off base or without orders.  Unless we wanted to go to prison.

You’ve seen something like the “Wildcat” in the last James Bond Film “Skyfall”  The shotgun shells under the floor board. Although I can’t remember if the had any type of barrel to direct the shot upward or contain the shell so it would go off properly.


Anti-ambush weapons, 1975-1980 / by P.G. Locke – Heritage of Zimbabwe: (1993), no. 12, p. 61-85
Used under “Fair Use” 17 U.S.C. § 107 For commentary, criticism and education purposes.

By the way.  the author of this article wrote a book I am trying to find a copy of for my personal reference library.

Fighting vehicles and weapons of Rhodesia, 1965-80 Peter G. Locke, Peter D. F. Cooke ISBN13: 9780473024130 ISBN10: 0473024136

The Texas A&M Library in College Station in the Cushing Library has the book, but it’s a 4 hour drive for me to get there and I highly doubt they would let me sit there with my netbook and my scanner scanning the whole book in. I found one, ONE other copy in the UK, but the cost with shipping to me is over $180.00.  So if any of my readers sees it, let me know.  I’ll pay a reasonable cost to get a good edition of the book.